sawblade hardness

soundmind

KNIFE MAKER
I'm wondering what hardness these homemade blades ground out of saw blades I see might be? I'm thinking handsaws, skillsaw blades with or without carbides, chopsaw blades, concrete blades, wood and metal sawzall blades, and saw mill blades (bandsaw or circular(?)).
 
I don't really know about any of the others, but saw mill bandsaw blades are almost always 15N20 (at least here in the PNW), so HRC of up to 64 as quenched (IIRC) I use this in my damascus with 1080 and after tempering at 375F, get HRC of 61-62,

If i had to guess, I'd say any blade with carbide teeth, or concrete blades that have an abrasive edge applied won't harden adequately.
 
sawblade steel will harden and temper great.......it is not hard enough on its own to grind a knife from without hardening and tempering......you can heat the edge with an oxy/acet torch to non magnetic and quench in oil and a file will skate great....temper at 375.....will actually show a good hamon this way .......i also will heat the whole blade in the forge before grinding bevels and then quench....temper and grind with good results....you can get a very thin edge on chef knives this way....i am using the large sawmill band saws [15n20] and the 20 to 24 inch circular trimsaw blades from a local sawmill...the 15n20 especially makes a good knife and doesn't tarnish as much as the circular blades do
 
They could be 15n20 Or they could be any number of other things. Why risk it? Never know what those blades have been through either.
 
This is another example of dealing with "Spec Manufacturing"...... it's a crapshoot as to what the specific alloy of any given "saw blade" is (setting aside the sawmill BANDSAW type blades, which can USUALLY be counted on as 15N20). Even blades from the same brand, same size, same everything, can be, and often are, different alloys from production run to production run. Yes, some will harden enough to preform as a knife blade, but then again, then next one used, even if the exact same everything, may not. You can pretty much discount blades with carbide teeth right out of the gate. Those are the most likely to NOT make decent knife blades. In the end, it's just a better overall policy to use new, known materials/steel. I see where some folks like the romance of repurposing something, but a knife blade is not one of those things.
 
If you're talking about those that are simply cut and ground out of blade, and otherwise untreated, I'll guess 45-52.

I'm going to break ranks here and expect to get beat up for it.

Some people like that kind of stuff. It doesn't make the greatest knives. Just like trap springs, wrought iron, and old files. But there is a historical aspect to homemade knives, and people pay money for them because they want the experience of it, I guess. So long as it is represented fairly, I say let em do their thing. The only real draw back I think is the misinformation out there that those things make good knives. Sometimes they do, but not usually. And almost never by someone who is making their first few knives.
 
You can buy a spectrum analyzer that will determine what kind of steel you have. It will even tell you what percentage of carbon, moly, etc.

The company I used to work for had one of these in Quality Control. However they are way too expensive for the average knife shop.
 
That's all helpful. I need some outside perspective.

What do you all think for Old hickory knives?

I'm thinking about what steel to continue purchasing and what hardness to draw in order to offer something "similar" to what some people have. No doubt I see a lot of commercial stainless, too, but I'm thinking to say: "It should sharpen, hold an edge, and will tarnish like an ulu." I have a batch of 80crv2 and 15n20 knives in process.

I know it's a shot in the dark on these steel types and saw blades are unconventional on this forum. I appreciate the responses. Like I said I needed some outside perspective from people like myself who actually think about this stuff "a lot."
 
The 80 crv2 knives are 59HRC.
It just seemed the saw blades without carbides would be heat treated for wear resistance. I thought it'd be way higher than 45-52. I thought at least 57-61 just guessing.
 
The 80 crv2 knives are 59HRC.
It just seemed the saw blades without carbides would be heat treated for wear resistance. I thought it'd be way higher than 45-52. I thought at least 57-61 just guessing.
 
I love Old Hickory knives. I have seen it stated more than once that they are 1095. That doesn't make it true.

Some saw blades may be harder on the tooth. Like Ed said, lots of what you named is a crap shoot. IMO, the best way to utilize reclaimed material is to get enough of it to justify having it analyzed, or trial and error until you get a workable HT figured out.
 
When were working on fish (with ulu knives) I notice we through a lot before the knife needs resharpening. So I began to wonder how hard they were compared to what I'm making. Especially if 80crv2 and 15n20 are some steels used for saw blades in general.

Some saw blades may be harder on the tooth.
I've know an ulu maker who suggested using the cutting edge of the saw for the edge of the ulu. Just sayin'.

There are ways to test that. Sharpening both types and compare how long they'll hold an edge. But my knives are thicker than the ulus but it might not be enough to make a noticeable difference. I need to read Cashen's thread on heat treat and geometry.

I do have an idea to shape drill bits, pieces files, punches, etc (tools of different hardness yet still unknown) and grinding them into the exact same point or ball. Just waiting to think of a way to apply consistent measurable pressure instead of a hammer strike.
 
I have a couple of vintage sawmill saws produced well before carbide teeth. As far as the steel i’m guessing 5160 but really have no clue. I use it for machetes and bush craft knives
 
Perhaps just dropping the hammer head from a consistent height?
Yeah... and I know how hard I'm hitting, too.... a hammer tap is a hammer tap....etc. I thought of that later.

And again, this is for me to compare the edge holding of the knives I'm making with some of the kinds of knives made and used locally.
 
Induction hardening maybe. (?)
It definitely shows if you grind those teeth off maybe no hardness on the edge...

I think people, including myself, don't realize how standards could change for steel so don't realize how that would effect ulu's made the same way as always.

And come to think of it I do know another ulu maker who given some indication he doesn't use new handsaw blades for his ulu knives. In his case experience does still give intuition.
 
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