A newbie's dilemma.

F

FullFreyDog

Guest
So I'm really looking for some experienced maker insight here.

I've all ready described my "shop" situation in my introduction, but at the risk of sounding redundant... here it is again.

I've been working with a HF 1x30 so far and while it works... I've found myself wanting something a bit better. Now I'm perfectly capable of saving the money for a NWG or possibly even Tracey's new unreleased grinder, but have some pretty steep limitations on what my "shop" can handle.

All of my grinding takes place outside, but all of my tools have to be stored upstairs in my apartment. I have plenty of outdoor space to work with, but need equipment that I can haul around. It seems like a lot of the 2x72 grinders weigh in at over 100lbs and are just too impractical for my limitations. Add on to that the fact that my main work table is a stone garden table that I cannot bolt anything down to, and I begin to wonder if there are any realistic options available to me.

I've considered the Craftsman 2x42 but wonder if it's even a real upgrade from my current set up. I think that maybe if I had any experience whatsoever at building complicated machines, I could figure out a NWG style set up that I could break down into a few parts and move.. but I don't have any experience and for all I know such a thing could be impossible.

I know you guys get a lot of grinder questions here, and I know that what I should really do is figure out a way to make a 2x72 work for me... but I just don't know if it's possible. I know that almost all of you have experience with a variety of 2x72's (hopefully one of them being an affordable machine that is somehow portable), and that a few of you have experience with the Craftsman.

As far as my budget goes, I think I could manage $500-$600 in a few months, which seems like it would restrict me to the lower end of the NWG builds or maybe a Coote or something. I'd like a machine that could break down into manageable pieces of around 50 lbs or so. I could physically carry a much heavier machine, but don't like the idea of maneuvering my narrow French Quarter stairwell with one. The machine _has_ to be able to operate safely without being bolted down.

Does any such magical device exist?

And thanks in advance to any member who has had to deal with this exact same sort of question before, will surely encounter again, and yet manages to answer with patience and grace. I can't speak for all ignorant ponces trying to figure out this knifemaking racket, but I know that at least one is extremely grateful.
 
By all means find a way to make the 2x72 work for you. One possibility to ease in the issue of carrying everything back and for the would be to mount the motor in such a way that you could easily take it off when you were done and ready to haul everything back upstairs.

Charlie
 
Good idea, a 2x72 without the motor would weigh less than a craftsman. You could also look at a handcart. Does the stone table have a ledge. If so you could clamp it with C clamps. If not maybe put rubber on the bottom.
 
I agree with the masses here. Go with the NWG. I believe It was Jeff Pearce who built his for approximately $400. If you have the ability to weld or know someone who does, I believe you could make the NWG "modular" to where it could be easily moved in pieces using wing nuts to mount it to a base. Just remember that every time you disassemble and reassemble you'll have to check and recheck everything to insure it is "square" and securely reassembled. After purchasing my KMG and later having the opportunity to see a Koote in action I would strongly recommend the NWG over the Koote or other less expensive alternatives.
 
While I am sure you can figure out a way to make the grinder modular I am not sure how you would make the machine safe without being able to bolt it down. A stone table does not lend itself to safe clamping. I a lockable secure shed a possibility, even a small garden type container may be enough to hold the really heavy parts. Then you could make a semi portable stand for the NWG. How do yu currently keep the 1 X 30 from skittering all over the table?
Hope this helps
Steve
 
I aslo should have added that you will need a base plate with a substantial mass to it. If your base plate is heavy enough, there is no need to mount it. I've been using my KMG for moths and it is just sitting on top of my rollaway tool chest. The only time it moves is when I move it.
 
Good Point I hadn't thought of that. Not fun to lug up and down the stairs but it would allow you to not have to bolt it down.
 
The 1x30 has little rubber feet that grip the stone fairly well, but the 1x30 doesn't run with much gusto anyway.

What's the ball park weight on an average NWG, and how much of that is the motor?

There is a shed in the back, but it's rickety and damp. I guess I could buy one of those mega huge plastic tubs and keep most of the grinder in that and move any parts that I feel need it. This is New Orleans, so when I say damp, I mean I have a sauna that's falling apart for a shed.

I have zero welding skill, but hopefully that won't make the project impossible.
 
So I was looking around at USAknifemaker again and noticed something I hadn't seen before.

In the information or FAQ section about the frame kit that's for sale, it says the shipping weight is 42lbs. As I understand it (and I may be wrong here) the tooling arm for NWG's is removable, so whatever platen/wheel set up I get going will by default be something I can remove and carry seperately. Since it's been mentioned that I could set the motor up to be removable, and what I'm seeing on ebay is averaging 30-45 lbs...

It's looking like I could divide the machine into at least three chunks for transport, and that the three pieces will be easily manageable. The only real specific thing I'll have to modify for my NWG would be base plate (enlarged for more stability, perhaps adding rubber for better traction), and make the mounting for the motor easy to unfasten.

Again, am I missing something that is like glaringly apparent when the machine is sitting in front of you? And if this is all possible, how difficult would the changes be to make? Please keep in mind that I've never attempted something like this.

Seriously, the closest thing to any of this I've come is buying things with "some assembly required".

And thanks to all you guys for your replies. I'm really happy to find out that the NWG is at least a realistic option for what I'm doing.
 
Just a thought that came to mind.....a good footing for your base plate could be very easy. Go to a sporting goods store or get on-line and look for some hockey pucks. Find "center" and drill a countersunk hole and attach with bolts. That would even give you enough clearance to where you wouldn't have to counter sink your holes for your other bolt holes. It would also make it easier when you pick up the base plate when moving it. Heck, I think I'm going to try this for my KMG's base plate. That thing is a pain in the rump to grab ahold of whenever I need to move it.
 
The biggest and heaviest part would be the base plate and arm holding assembly attached to it. I would hate to try and move mine but then mine is a KMG with 1/2" steel base plate. Something that will give you the stability but still be moveable sounds like it should work.
Steve
 
Build the NWG. Mount it on a 2' x 2' piece of 3/4 pywood.
Buy a cheap hand truck. Take the grinder down with the hand truck then c- clamp it down to the stone table. Grind knives and keep your eyes open for an apt on the lower floor.:D
 
I worked in mobile machine shops when I was in the Army. Some of our shops would open up to open air. Can You have like a Garden Cabinet or locker outside that you can lock. Build your knife shop in cabinet. Kinda like a Murphy's bed. Just a thought.
 
I just built a grinder similar to the NWG. I scrounged around for most of the metal and some other parts I made. I have under $400.00 in it including a 3/4 hp motor. The motor should be at least a 1 1/2 hp it is under powered with 3/4 hp. I just bought a 1 1/2 hp motor and it is much better.

The grinder frame as a unit with jack shaft, drive wheel, tracking wheel, is around 40 lbs, 1 1/2 hp motor ( which easily can be removed ) is 34 lbs. The 8" contact wheel with the arm ( which easily slides off main frame ) weighs around ( my guess ) 15 lbs.

Use a 3/4 thick piece of plywood big enough to accommodate your motor and grinder base, add rubber feet to the bottom and the weight off the grinder will keep it in place while you are grinding.

When separated these pieces are pretty easy to manage by themselves.

Check out my grinder WIP to see what my grinder looks like and how it was built. Hope this helps.

Larry
 
I weighed my Welded No Weld Grinder (that sounds like an oxymoron to me) for Rey the other day in order to figure out the cost of shipping one to him. It was 122.8 pounds. My tool arm is more than the 15# because it has a two inch contact wheel, an eight inch contact wheel with the slack belt and flat platen all on the one tool arm. My bases are 3/4" plywood or Advantec that is 16" X 22". I mount the motor on a piece of plywood or Advantec that is 8" X 9" and is hinged to provide the belt tension. The hinges could be bolted on using 1/4-20 bolts with T-nuts. That way the motor can be removed and put back on and insure alignment. Then you have 2 pieces none more than 50#s. I can put you one together and send it to you or you can pick it up when you come to the Batson Blade Symposium the first week in April. Or, God forbid, you are not coming to the Batson Whing Ding get someone closer to you to pick it up. Figure the cost of shipping and use that money to fund the trip to Alabama. Ha!
 
FullFreyDog said:
So I'm really looking for some experienced maker insight here.

I've all ready described my "shop" situation in my introduction, but at the risk of sounding redundant... here it is again.

I've been working with a HF 1x30 so far and while it works... I've found myself wanting something a bit better. Now I'm perfectly capable of saving the money for a NWG or possibly even Tracey's new unreleased grinder, but have some pretty steep limitations on what my "shop" can handle.

All of my grinding takes place outside, but all of my tools have to be stored upstairs in my apartment. I have plenty of outdoor space to work with, but need equipment that I can haul around. It seems like a lot of the 2x72 grinders weigh in at over 100lbs and are just too impractical for my limitations. Add on to that the fact that my main work table is a stone garden table that I cannot bolt anything down to, and I begin to wonder if there are any realistic options available to me.

I've considered the Craftsman 2x42 but wonder if it's even a real upgrade from my current set up. I think that maybe if I had any experience whatsoever at building complicated machines, I could figure out a NWG style set up that I could break down into a few parts and move.. but I don't have any experience and for all I know such a thing could be impossible.

I know you guys get a lot of grinder questions here, and I know that what I should really do is figure out a way to make a 2x72 work for me... but I just don't know if it's possible. I know that almost all of you have experience with a variety of 2x72's (hopefully one of them being an affordable machine that is somehow portable), and that a few of you have experience with the Craftsman.

As far as my budget goes, I think I could manage $500-$600 in a few months, which seems like it would restrict me to the lower end of the NWG builds or maybe a Coote or something. I'd like a machine that could break down into manageable pieces of around 50 lbs or so. I could physically carry a much heavier machine, but don't like the idea of maneuvering my narrow French Quarter stairwell with one. The machine _has_ to be able to operate safely without being bolted down.

Does any such magical device exist?

And thanks in advance to any member who has had to deal with this exact same sort of question before, will surely encounter again, and yet manages to answer with patience and grace. I can't speak for all ignorant ponces trying to figure out this knifemaking racket, but I know that at least one is extremely grateful.
Click to expand...


Hang in there Boss. I am making what you need. The grinder will be available soon from Tracy. Still have a few bugs to work out. Nothing good ever works the first time anyway. :rolleyes:
 
What about a NWG made with aluminum tube instead of steel tube? It would probably be cheaper and lighter. Strength might be an issue, but I would guess that the toolarm and toolarm tube would be the only places that would be a major concern.
 
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