Mill "requirements"

A little cleaning and some tuning and I get this...

Okay, so i cleaned and tuned up the drill press. Then I used my crappy Pittsburgh 4" vice, and some random carriage bolts, finger tightened, I dressed off 2" of some kind of chrome steel 3/8" rod with a file, and center drilled it to 1/4". It wasn't perfect, but everything wasn't tightened down either, and there is no V in the vice. Lowest thickness is 042 and highest was 069. I was off by 0.0125. I think I could blame that on any number of things, including not tightening everything down, or the crappy vice.

I think I can drill a relatively straight hole without a milling machine.

What is the next task that requires a mill over a drill press for knife making?


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Well... you can mill a blade profile. Heck, if you get a CNC (and learn Fusion 360 or similar - I can help if you want), you can mill the entire blade, bevels and all, then finish it up on the grinder.

With a fly cutter and a coarse feed rate, you can get a neat finish on knife scales. I'll take a picture of a Gerber I was screwing with the other day that had such a finish.


Again, making tooling and fixtures is a MILLION times easier with a mill.

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Well... you can mill a blade profile. Heck, if you get a CNC (and learn Fusion 360 or similar - I can help if you want), you can mill the entire blade, bevels and all, then finish it up on the grinder.

With a fly cutter and a coarse feed rate, you can get a neat finish on knife scales. I'll take a picture of a Gerber I was screwing with the other day that had such a finish.


Again, making tooling and fixtures is a MILLION times easier with a mill.

Sent from my Champion Forge using Tapatalk
Looks like a knurl...

I get that it can make things easier. And, if I owned one, I would likely get plenty of use out of it eventually. But again, the question in point is "Is it necessary?"

I ordered a new dial indicator today. When I get it, I will measure runout and other such things on the DP as well as the x-y table and so on. Once I get these vices tuned up and perhaps level, I will look into proper hardware to connect them to my table. From what my eye tells me I assume the pivot bushing is a 3/32 hole inside a 3/16 rod. That would leave a 3/64" wall. 0.0469 I think I can manage that. I don't have anything 3/16 to try on, but I think I have some 1/4 that I can try on, and possibly turn it down as well.

The other task is the liner relief. Which as far as I can tell is a 0.005 deep race offset around a center point. I assume, that an end mill, will cut on downward contact, like drilling a 0.005 deep hole. If I can control the depth with my stop, or simply the distance from the piece to the end of the end mill, I can certainly mount it to a pin, and offset that pin from center, then just do vertical cuts, and move the piece around the center point a small amount at a time, so that I get overlapping impressions the size of the endmill. If I want critical depth, I can bottom out the cutter on the piece for a zero cut. Then use some 0.005 shim stock to elevate the piece exactly that distance. As I understand it, this distance isn't exactly critical so long as it is greater than 0 and less that something that would be visibly offensive to the eye.

I think, for the moment at least, that I have talked myself out of the necessity of a mill, at least for the time being. I do recognize that dealing with any precision z-axis cutting, I will have to be creative.

I will see if I can reproduce Tony Bose's pivot bushings. Then i will see if i can make proper threaded standoffs for Corby's, and Loveless.

The other task, I am not quite comfortable with would be turning down something from one size to another. e.g. 1/4 - 3/16. But what I think I can do is rig up a live or even dead 60° center that I can mount on the table. I have done something similar before and having the counter pressure seemed to keep it from puking out the MT. Much in the same way that my lathe doesn't puke out the spur drive when I turn between centers. Pretty sure all that will take is something to use as a center that can fit in a bearing, and mount a bearing into a piece of something that can be fixed to the table. One of the guys on one of the machinist groups simply drilled/reamed a MT0 into his DP table, and it can hold s 0 live center. So there's that. None of these ideas are even coming close to $3k so for now these are the kind of things I am considering instead of throwing money at these tasks/problems. The main problems I see with a DP over a Milling machine seem to involve "chuck work" and lateral motion. If I can solve those problems "between centers" then I expand my usage of an existing tool. Money in my pocket! Or at least 3 grand worth of knives I don't have to sell. :)
 
Looks like a knurl...

I get that it can make things easier. And, if I owned one, I would likely get plenty of use out of it eventually. But again, the question in point is "Is it necessary?"

I ordered a new dial indicator today. When I get it, I will measure runout and other such things on the DP as well as the x-y table and so on. Once I get these vices tuned up and perhaps level, I will look into proper hardware to connect them to my table. From what my eye tells me I assume the pivot bushing is a 3/32 hole inside a 3/16 rod. That would leave a 3/64" wall. 0.0469 I think I can manage that. I don't have anything 3/16 to try on, but I think I have some 1/4 that I can try on, and possibly turn it down as well.

The other task is the liner relief. Which as far as I can tell is a 0.005 deep race offset around a center point. I assume, that an end mill, will cut on downward contact, like drilling a 0.005 deep hole. If I can control the depth with my stop, or simply the distance from the piece to the end of the end mill, I can certainly mount it to a pin, and offset that pin from center, then just do vertical cuts, and move the piece around the center point a small amount at a time, so that I get overlapping impressions the size of the endmill. If I want critical depth, I can bottom out the cutter on the piece for a zero cut. Then use some 0.005 shim stock to elevate the piece exactly that distance. As I understand it, this distance isn't exactly critical so long as it is greater than 0 and less that something that would be visibly offensive to the eye.

I think, for the moment at least, that I have talked myself out of the necessity of a mill, at least for the time being. I do recognize that dealing with any precision z-axis cutting, I will have to be creative.

I will see if I can reproduce Tony Bose's pivot bushings. Then i will see if i can make proper threaded standoffs for Corby's, and Loveless.

The other task, I am not quite comfortable with would be turning down something from one size to another. e.g. 1/4 - 3/16. But what I think I can do is rig up a live or even dead 60° center that I can mount on the table. I have done something similar before and having the counter pressure seemed to keep it from puking out the MT. Much in the same way that my lathe doesn't puke out the spur drive when I turn between centers. Pretty sure all that will take is something to use as a center that can fit in a bearing, and mount a bearing into a piece of something that can be fixed to the table. One of the guys on one of the machinist groups simply drilled/reamed a MT0 into his DP table, and it can hold s 0 live center. So there's that. None of these ideas are even coming close to $3k so for now these are the kind of things I am considering instead of throwing money at these tasks/problems. The main problems I see with a DP over a Milling machine seem to involve "chuck work" and lateral motion. If I can solve those problems "between centers" then I expand my usage of an existing tool. Money in my pocket! Or at least 3 grand worth of knives I don't have to sell. :)
Right. It is a knurl. On flat stock, you mill or engrave the knurling.

You don't NEED a milling machine to do this, you could do it with a shaper or maybe a pantagraph.

The fly cutter method is very fast, though. This is because a line is being cut once per rev.

Round stuff needs a lathe.

Contoured surfaces can be done with a CNC mill (or lathe with live tooling).

You can even throw a finished knife on the CNC mill table and checker it (or otherwise engrave it) following the contours by utilizing surface mapping (Google surface mapping if you end up with a CNC)

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Or you could engrave by hand... but ain't nobody got time that dat.

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Well... you can mill a blade profile. Heck, if you get a CNC (and learn Fusion 360 or similar - I can help if you want), you can mill the entire blade, bevels and all, then finish it up on the grinder.

With a fly cutter and a coarse feed rate, you can get a neat finish on knife scales. I'll take a picture of a Gerber I was screwing with the other day that had such a finish.


Again, making tooling and fixtures is a MILLION times easier with a mill.

Sent from my Champion Forge using Tapatalk
Of course, properly sized bushings are available for $4 and change, and a pair of bronze washers are like $65 cents.. I could buy a lot of both of them for $3k :)
Right. It is a knurl. On flat stock, you mill or engrave the knurling.

You don't NEED a milling machine to do this, you could do it with a shaper or maybe a pantagraph.

The fly cutter method is very fast, though. This is because a line is being cut once per rev.

Round stuff needs a lathe.

Contoured surfaces can be done with a CNC mill (or lathe with live tooling).

You can even throw a finished knife on the CNC mill table and checker it (or otherwise engrave it) following the contours by utilizing surface mapping (Google surface mapping if you end up with a CNC)

Sent from my Champion Forge using Tapatalk
Okay, still going to file it under nice to have. With CNC as even nicer to have. But all completely unnecessary. :(
 
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