first art knife design critique

T

Travis Fry

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure if this is the best forum for this, and my apologies in advance if not. I've generally been making hunting knives for people that use them(just finished #96), but am slowly upgrading my equipment and quality, and am moving more toward the art knife/collector market. My first artistic endeavor was wood carving (long before knives) so I wanted to combine this skill with my knifemaking to make something special and unique. I hope this ends up being my "break out knife" for the higher end collector's market, but we'll see. The design is informed by the work of several other makers, which some of y'all will likely recognize.

Plans are for the handle to be curly koa, blade will be hollow ground (5 inch wheel) W2 with a hamon, sharp on both sides. Guard may be wrought iron, bronze, stainless, or blued 1018. I haven't decided yet, but am leaning toward bronze after seeing that huge fighter of Ray Richards' recently. OAL will be in the 12-14 inch range. Let me know what you think of my plans, and please feel free to offer suggestions. I'm posting this here so y'all can help make this knife better, not for "attaboys". My ego is pretty stable, so say what you think. Thanks in advance.

horse knife.jpg
 
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The last couple inches of the tip should be fun.
I do a bit of hollow grinding and don't find it all that difficult except the last couple inches towards the tip. Seems harder with the 5" wheel. But I do it anyway. The design looks good and the carving looks intricate. Go for it.

Rudy
 
If you can draw it that well, you can make it. I'd love to see ebony or ivory for the handle but, that's a personal choice.
 
I'm not sure if I'm 100% crazy about the pointy front edges of the ricasso or the notches where the edges start. Otherwise It's fantastic !

I may make the horse's mane just a teeny bit more pronounced and wrap it around to near the centerline of the handle. I'd at least try that on paper and then see what I thought.

I like the Mark's idea of Ebony and would add an Ivory inlay for his nose markings (not sure what they're called ???)

Even if you made it exactly to your print it's gonna be spectacular and I can't wait to see it !!!

-Josh
 
I appreciate the suggestions fellas. Josh, I think I'm with you about the ricasso and notches. I plan to play with that a little more, and will check out the mane idea on paper. I've been wondering about that too, and honestly I'll probably make a maquette in clay before I ever cut wood, both to play with ideas and to have a model when I do the real thing.

I'm also planning to put a little more curve in the handle to give the neck a bit more arch, and to make the head less tilted to make the grip more comfortable and provide a space for the pinky finger. I like the idea of ebony, as suggested. That's what I carved almost every day for a year when I lived in Africa (long story), so I actually feel pretty comfortable with it. It might be too chippy, but I like the idea. I picked koa because 1) I have a piece the right size, 2) it's soft and carves easily and 3) it looks nice, but I'm certainly not set.

Great feedback so far; please keep it coming!
 
Travis. This will be a great piece! I believe that your curve at the tip is just a bit too high. The curved handle will certainly and more good styling. Frank
 
I had the same thoughts that Ronald had, with the horses nose turning into the hand, it could end up creating some discomfort for those with bigger hands, I understand you're shooting for a same queen here, but most of the collectors I know want it to be "functional art". Other than that, it's BEAUTIFUL! I also agree with Josh, sweeping the mane up the handle, it'll increase the flow of the entire design, and could possibly provide a palm swell, which would add some comfort.

I too am wanting to get into some handle carving....just not anything as advanced as what you have in mind! I just want to be able to add a textured relief area, for a little added grip and hopefully to add some prettty to it! And definitely some silver wire inlay, done right it is classy....now, if I can only do it RIGHT!!!! Looking forward to seeing this one, thinking about doing a WIP? Hhhmmmm? We want to KNOW!!!! Rex
 
Thanks for the feedback!

I played with the mane, and still haven't decided what to do. I'll play with it more, I'm sure, before I'm happy. I took suggestions from the fellow KD's and also did a lot more studying of historical blades and made some mods accordingly. The blade (I didn't change it, but might a bit) is still classic Turkish/Kurdish khanjar with the exception of the ricasso and choil notches (sorry Josh, gonna leave 'em), but the handle is more reminiscent of the Mughal khanjars from India, which were influenced more by the Persian style than the Arab. The guard is not anything traditional, and of course neither is W2 with a hamon.

With the exception of the yet to be determined mane, what do y'all think? Sorry for the stripes. I sketched it on lined paper, then cut out and taped the new handle to a copy of the original before scanning. Maybe it'll help for koa visualization!
horse knifemod.jpg
 
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Did you say Hamon? On a double edged blade, SWEEEEEEET! BUT, how wide is the blade going to be edge to edge? Just curious, with a hamon, you want enough room to allow the hamon line to do whatever it decides to do, that's all I'm saying, it's a great design, I think the change in angle of the head will work a little better. How long are you planning for the entire length of the handle? That also could have bearing on the angle of the horses head, if it's long enough the original design would have worked, but your talking about a handle that would end up in the 5 1/2 to 6+ inch range, which would probably not flow very well, then again you don't know these things until you get it made! Which is too much work and too expensive to guess at. I love the design, the choils will come in handy when it's time to sharpen it. The only thing I can think that would make that a negative, is those collectors that collect this particular type of blade where they want an accurate repro of the era, I still think there should be some room for the makers interpretation, but I aint the cat with the dollars to put down on a beautiful safe queen like this either! Still a sweet design, and I can't wait to see those grinds, they look SCARY to me! That is, if I was attempting it, I'm a flat grinder, but I love the ridge seperating the 2 sides, I'd end up hand sanding it out with my luck! Looking forward to seeing MORE, Rex
 
Overall it's looking like it'll be 15 inches or so, and the blade will be 9-9 1/2' of that if i don't shorten it a bit. I've got a full scale drawing on my desk, an I'm thnking the blade might be too long. The width will be something around 1 inch, from 1/4" stock unless I change plans. I'm not sure what that'll mean in terms of the hamon; I've not done one with W2. I was planning to do this one stock removal, but I may forge it out wider if the opportunity arises.

I'm a bit intimidated by the grinds as well, since I've only flat ground too. I plan to hollow grind several for practice first, including at least one of this pattern. As mentioned, I'll use my 5" wheel, but I'm also thinking about cleaning up the centerline with a 3/4" wheel to make the ridge sharper. That might be too much trouble, but it would look great if I can pull it off. I know Bruce Bump sometimes does something similar on some of his bowies.
 
Travis, all thats left is to go for it! Shoot for the stars Brother, if you get close you would have done good!
I think it's a great idea to try some practice runs, hollow grinds are trickier than they look, getting the 2 arcs on each side of the blade in the right place is a bit of a PITA! I did one, where the edge ended up thicker than it was about 1/4" or so, a little higher up from the edge. THAT area was thin as paper! It showed during testing, it wrinkled up like tin foil! If I had not tested that blade it would have been a huge embarassment, it was a beautiful knife and beefy looking, I'm just so glad I found it, and a customer didn't!!!

I remember someone had posted a scale for hollow grinding, I can't remember where it was posted, but it might come in handy, if you can find out what it's actually called and where it is, all I remember is that I wanted to get a copy of it if ever did another hollow grind!

Good Luck! You never know, hollow grinding might end up being your thang! Rex
 
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