Stabilized Wood?

Kevin Zito

KNIFE MAKER
So in a previous post we chatted about using stab wood in my upcoming projects. Well, I stated digging in one of my Dennis Moreland gift boxes and found some stabilized buckeye. It is beautiful, Demo, thank you. Now what in the world is this lol? I’ve looked it up and have familiarized myself with the material, but wow! that is some strange stuff, no? It grinds smoothly, polishes well, and seems like it will last a loooong time. So, are there any drawbacks to it, besides price?
 
Generally stabilized wood is great material to work with, I've not had to much experience with it as I have no need for it in my main works. I do know that since it is can be expensive make sure you're getting good quality material. I have heard that vacuum chambers aren't too spendy these days so that could be a possible investment if you plan on using stabilized material often. I'm no expert but it seems that the main worry would be the species of wood used and type of resin used.
 
Generally stabilized wood is great material to work with, I've not had to much experience with it as I have no need for it in my main works. I do know that since it is can be expensive make sure you're getting good quality material. I have heard that vacuum chambers aren't too spendy these days so that could be a possible investment if you plan on using stabilized material often. I'm no expert but it seems that the main worry would be the species of wood used and type of resin used.
I wonder if anyone ever tried to do cypress... it would be beautiful
 
Generally stabilized wood is great material to work with, I've not had to much experience with it as I have no need for it in my main works. I do know that since it is can be expensive make sure you're getting good quality material. I have heard that vacuum chambers aren't too spendy these days so that could be a possible investment if you plan on using stabilized material often. I'm no expert but it seems that the main worry would be the species of wood used and type of resin used


Kevin, I dabbled a bit in home stabilization. Why right now I have a chunk of Elk antler I stabilized in a mason jar on my workbench. And that is where it will stay. I pulled a vacuum on it and let it sit in the solution over night and pulled a second vacuum on it. Then I put it on the bench to be put through the heat to cure. Only thing is we had a plumbing disaster here and as things go, (life happens)!! My work bench got hit by an avalanche of working till late and too tired to put up things. So about 3 months past and I decide I have to get the bench uncovered and get back to work on some knives. As I am moving all the junk off the bench and putting it where each piece and tool belongs.
I discovered the mason jar. Oh crap, I forgot all about that, I wonder if I can still heat treat it to finish the cure??? Nope it is already hard. So I contacted the Cactus Juice guy and give him the story and well,............................he says I have a new paper weight. The mix will sometimes go hard once it has been used. So now it sits on my bench as a reminder that I will probably be better off it I buy the next stabilized wood.

Often you will see someone on this forum selling stabilized wood. I have learned it is probably just as well to buy it!! Usually the stabilization is deeper than you can get in the home method!! Another thing I once had a seasoned maker ask me if I wanted to build accessories for knives or knives!! After thinking about that a few minutes I decided I would rather be making knives!!! However to each his own!!
 
I'm waiting to hear from someone who has tried it, but I don't think you can stabilize cypress. Cypress is a very oily wood, which is why the stuff is incredible for wet climates and doesn't rot. I've never heard of anyone using cypress for handles but to my mind it would be like rosewood or cocobolo in that it won't take, nor would it require, stabilization.

I'm ready to be wrong, though. Hopefully somebody more familiar will chime in.
 
There are a LOT of ins and outs with stabilizing, and with stabilized wood/materials. Stabilizing was originally intended to make those materials that would otherwise be unusable.....usable. Things such as "splalted" (another word for rotted) :), or material that would otherwise be too soft or "punky" to use. The misconception quickly formed that stabilizing was a "cure all" to prevent shirking, expansion, etc., and for a while I even thought so..... but after a few years of attempting my own stabilizing, I learned much.

First of all, to achieve durable, long lasting results, you need to use "industrial" grade equipment, the devices and agents that is mostly targeted at knifemakers either simply do not work, or work for a comparatively short time. I came to understand that if you want anything more than a "band-aid", you either need to be willing to spend "big bucks" for industrial grade stabilizing equipment and agents, or the less expensive route is to send the materials to a "professional" stabilizer.

When it comes to materials, the learning curve is long to understand what materials can or cannot be stabilized, and understand those materials that it "sorta" works on.

The short of it is this..... ANY natural material that will shrink or expand, will still do so if stabilized..... depending on the given material, stabilizing may or not minimize the issue(s)....but it will not completely solve it.

Then there is the undesirable characteristics that stabilizing imparts to certain materials....a couple that come to mind is African Blackwood and Koa. With these woods, stabilizing gives the finished product a "cloudy" appearance when compared to the wood in it's natural state.... and this can vary from barely noticeable, to flat out ugly.

Finally, even at the "professional" level, all stabilizing is not created equal. Different stabilizing agents used by different "professionals" yield different results. Time and experience has taught me to send specific materials to specific stabilizers in order to acquire the "best" results.

My personal opinion is that if you want the "best" results/end products, let the "professionals" do it. It's more cost effective, and the results are typically far better than "home brewed" stabilizing. You'll have to be willing to do a LOT of homework to find which stabilizer's process and chemicals work best for given materials, and you'll also want to keep good records of the EXACT number and types of materials you send off..... more than a few times I have been literally ripped off! In one case, I was shorted more then 1/2 the wood blocks I had sent in to a particular stabilizer..... I fought for nearly a year trying to get those blocks, with no success.
 
So in a previous post we chatted about using stab wood in my upcoming projects. Well, I stated digging in one of my Dennis Moreland gift boxes and found some stabilized buckeye. It is beautiful, Demo, thank you. Now what in the world is this lol? I’ve looked it up and have familiarized myself with the material, but wow! that is some strange stuff, no? It grinds smoothly, polishes well, and seems like it will last a loooong time. So, are there any drawbacks to it, besides price?

Kevin, it seems you're asking are there any drawbacks to your stabilized buckeye? None whatsoever! That buckeye is one of the prettiest handle making woods around. I LOVE IT! but it's just so darn expensive.

Now to all those comments about home stabilizing - it can work pretty darn good for a few blocks here 'n there of a open pore type wood.

Step 1. Dry that wood DRY! heat to 212F for 24 hr at least.

Step 2. put blocks of wood in container, cover with resin (Cactus Juice is good) and pull vacuum to 29 inches for at least 2 hrs - more perhaps. None of the resin goes into wood during vacuum pulling stage, you're pulling air from open places in wood. Keep vacuum pump running this whole time to hold vacuum to 29 inches.

step 3. when all those bubbles of air no longer come from wood (after a few hrs), the vacuum is turned off and resin starts being pulled into wood. Leave overnight for this process - perhaps even a couple of days won't hurt anything.

Step 4. wipe excess resin from wood, wrap in tinfoil, place in temperature controlled oven at 200F for at least 2 hrs for resin to cure.

Done this way the resin should be all the way thru the block of wood, it should sink in water just like stabilized wood from K&G. Not all wood can be home stabilized, as said before, it's got to be an open type pore wood. Spalted Maple works really good. Black Walnut not so good.

Ken H>
 
Kevin, it seems you're asking are there any drawbacks to your stabilized buckeye? None whatsoever! That buckeye is one of the prettiest handle making woods around. I LOVE IT! but it's just so darn expensive.

Now to all those comments about home stabilizing - it can work pretty darn good for a few blocks here 'n there of a open pore type wood.

Step 1. Dry that wood DRY! heat to 212F for 24 hr at least.

Step 2. put blocks of wood in container, cover with resin (Cactus Juice is good) and pull vacuum to 29 inches for at least 2 hrs - more perhaps. None of the resin goes into wood during vacuum pulling stage, you're pulling air from open places in wood. Keep vacuum pump running this whole time to hold vacuum to 29 inches.

step 3. when all those bubbles of air no longer come from wood (after a few hrs), the vacuum is turned off and resin starts being pulled into wood. Leave overnight for this process - perhaps even a couple of days won't hurt anything.

Step 4. wipe excess resin from wood, wrap in tinfoil, place in temperature controlled oven at 200F for at least 2 hrs for resin to cure.

Done this way the resin should be all the way thru the block of wood, it should sink in water just like stabilized wood from K&G. Not all wood can be home stabilized, as said before, it's got to be an open type pore wood. Spalted Maple works really good. Black Walnut not so good.

Ken H>
Guys...in my experimenting I did two thing that made a difference. I added dye to the fluid to make sure I was really penetrating the wood (I wasn't at first...as I suspected) The second was to stand the wood up with the end grain up and down. I know you may have been told otherwise but it seems to make a difference. I ordered some burlsource stabilized wood and notice that the dried froth was on the end. This was very dense and a delight to work with so I tried my next batch standing up...Viola.

Once you know how heavy the wood should feel etc. you can ditch the dye. I used red for testing and everyone who has seen the wood LOVES it...

I'm not sure how much more I will test...my instinct is Ed is spot on as it being easier to farm out. I do have more fluid and unstabilized wood though....lol!
 
Two things I know for sure.
1) I ain’t building my own grinder.
2) I ain’t stabilizing my own wood.
I could see myself maybe possibly bending on number one. But number 2 ... I feel fairly firm that this one is safe lol. I’m terrible with glue lol.
 
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Ed is right, stablization methods vary. There are very few that do it at a very high quality. I personally only use K&G, WSSI, Wood Dynamics, or Little Woody's stablized woods. I know most people that stabilize their own woods at home only run their tank at about 150 to 200 psi. K@G say that they stabilize at 3000 psi. You definitely get what you pay for. And since you originally were talking about stabilized buckeye. Here's a knife I sold at the Spirit of the Blade show in Troy, OH over the weekend with some on it!

BBminihunter.jpg
 
Ed is right, stablization methods vary. There are very few that do it at a very high quality. I personally only use K&G, WSSI, Wood Dynamics, or Little Woody's stablized woods. I know most people that stabilize their own woods at home only run their tank at about 150 to 200 psi. K@G say that they stabilize at 3000 psi. You definitely get what you pay for. And since you originally were talking about stabilized buckeye. Here's a knife I sold at the Spirit of the Blade show in Troy, OH over the weekend with some on it!

View attachment 62810
Man that’s beautiful!!
 
I have probably 200 scales in stock and most are stabilized. Some natural and some dyed. I bought most of mine from guys that do a lot of stabilizing for pen blanks and game call blanks. I have had good luck with all of my material and never really had any issues with it. Great to work with and works up to a beautiful finish.

Antler and bone on the other hand.... can be really problematic at least for me.
 
I have used K&G several times and have always been pleased with the results. Unless you are going to do a lot of blanks, and perhaps sell some of them, the cost of set up may be steep compared to the amount of the use. I have never tried a home brew and probably will stick to using a professional service for stabilization. I just don't have the desire, the room or the tools necessary to do a good job. Others may vary in that opinion.
 
"I know most people that stabilize their own woods at home only run their tank at about 150 to 200 psi. K@G say that they stabilize at 3000 psi."

That would be the main issue right there. I have gotten full penetration at full vacuum...I doubt I got as much in the wood though.
 
I've thought about doing it for years, but after reading so many opinions and experiances about doing it in so many different places.....plus using some crappy so called stabilized wood done by home brewers in the past, I find myself not too interested in it. I've used a lot of K&G wood over the years and have never been disappointed, a little spendy but you get what you pay for. I've sent wood to them and that makes it a lot more affordable. the other thing that kind of turned me off from doing it is right now I'm cramped for space and it seems like every corner of my shop has flammables, explosive stuff, and just plain reapers waiting to grab me...I just don't need another chemical-tank-pump to deal with. I'll just stick to making knives and other stuff and leave the stabilizing business to someone else.
 
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