Knives for Servicemen-Maker input wanted
- Thread starter Justin King
- Start date
Steven Janik
SUPERMOD & AWARDS BOSS
Hey murph, would one of the little sport/utility models i call "KantLooz" work if it were blacked up a little.
See my post on custom knife forum.
Steve
See my post on custom knife forum.
Steve
Bill T
Well-Known Member
Being former Military , I've been watching this thread with great interest . If I read it right so far , you're 1) going to vote on a design 2) having Dave cut out Aldo's steel 3) looking for makers to grind and assemble the blanks . I love the idea of a Knife Dogs marked blade that we can donate as a community effort .
I was going to submit a design , but those submitted all have merit . I think the goals set out at the beginning have been met with them .
What about the sheaths though ? Are you thinking Kydex or Mil-Spec Nylon or Cordura with Mil style clips .
I would love to be involved with the knife making process , whatever is required . I have no experience with Kydex , although I have bought 3rd party Cordura for some of my models .
I'm in for a penny , in for a pound . If we need to buy a decent Mil sheath , pay for heat treat - whatever , I'm in .
How many blanks are we looking at with just what Aldo has donated - just trying to get an idea of how large or small an effort is needed .
Are we looking at supplying a platoon or individuals spread across the Services ? Or Family and Friends heading out ?
There's alot going on here , and it's all very exciting . I'm behind whatever is decided upon ....
Bill
murphda2
Super Moderator and KD Blade Show Boss
Good looking design IW.
"Doc Shiffer" and I had a good discussion about recurves a week or so ago. Recurves have become quite popular lately and have a great fuction as a "fighting knife". They offer a great bite when slashing at an opponent and even offer a bit of an advantage if used for chopping. The simple fact is that the largest percentage of soldiers will never use thier knife as a fighting knife. I'm not a SOCOM Operator, just your average everyday infantry soldier who loves and always carries a knife. Throughout my three deployments, I've yet to need a knife for fighting but I have used them for a multitood of utilitarian tasks.
The major problem IMO with recurves is that many people have a hard time sharpening them. Keep in mind that your average soldier is a knife user, but sucks at maintaining them. The majority of the soldiers I work with now and have worked with in the past have always brought thier knives to me for maintenance (sharpening and cleaning). Once again, IMO, the perfect knife for your average soldier should be a relatively simple utilitarian design that is easy to maintain. Most soldiers use thier knives for the same tasks that anyone else will use a knife for (opening boxes, cutting straps, rope, cords, etc.). The reason Rock and I each recommended smaller blades is that they are much easier to carry and use for multiple tasks.
Steve, your "Kantlooz" looks like a great little design. No need to "black it up", just anything other than BLAZE Orange, LOL.
Things I think we need to look at regardless of the design we choose are:
OAL: Approximately 10" (or less)
Blade Design: Utilitarian design which will be easy to maintain.
Handle design: "Comfortable" (nothing which will cause hot spots)
Sheath Design: Simple with multiple mounting configurations (ie. eyelets for use of Tek-Lok or Molle-Lok) this can be either kydex or leather, but keep in mind that leather will require maintenance in extreme heat and dust and will retain moisture during humid times.
Handle/Sheath Color: OD, tan, brown, or grey (anything not highly visible or black).
Though I have used black for sheaths for soldiers, it's not the best color to use. Keep in mind that black absorbs alot of heat when exposed to sunlight for extended periods of time and may cause distortion in kydex type material. Additionally, there's nothing worse than grabbing a black handled knife with your bare hand after being in 130 deg. heat for an hour or two.
Keep in mind, this is all just my $0.02 on the subject. I'm not an expert, but I am a soldier and I've been "down range" and know what has worked or not worked for me.
"Doc Shiffer" and I had a good discussion about recurves a week or so ago. Recurves have become quite popular lately and have a great fuction as a "fighting knife". They offer a great bite when slashing at an opponent and even offer a bit of an advantage if used for chopping. The simple fact is that the largest percentage of soldiers will never use thier knife as a fighting knife. I'm not a SOCOM Operator, just your average everyday infantry soldier who loves and always carries a knife. Throughout my three deployments, I've yet to need a knife for fighting but I have used them for a multitood of utilitarian tasks.
The major problem IMO with recurves is that many people have a hard time sharpening them. Keep in mind that your average soldier is a knife user, but sucks at maintaining them. The majority of the soldiers I work with now and have worked with in the past have always brought thier knives to me for maintenance (sharpening and cleaning). Once again, IMO, the perfect knife for your average soldier should be a relatively simple utilitarian design that is easy to maintain. Most soldiers use thier knives for the same tasks that anyone else will use a knife for (opening boxes, cutting straps, rope, cords, etc.). The reason Rock and I each recommended smaller blades is that they are much easier to carry and use for multiple tasks.
Steve, your "Kantlooz" looks like a great little design. No need to "black it up", just anything other than BLAZE Orange, LOL.
Things I think we need to look at regardless of the design we choose are:
OAL: Approximately 10" (or less)
Blade Design: Utilitarian design which will be easy to maintain.
Handle design: "Comfortable" (nothing which will cause hot spots)
Sheath Design: Simple with multiple mounting configurations (ie. eyelets for use of Tek-Lok or Molle-Lok) this can be either kydex or leather, but keep in mind that leather will require maintenance in extreme heat and dust and will retain moisture during humid times.
Handle/Sheath Color: OD, tan, brown, or grey (anything not highly visible or black).
Though I have used black for sheaths for soldiers, it's not the best color to use. Keep in mind that black absorbs alot of heat when exposed to sunlight for extended periods of time and may cause distortion in kydex type material. Additionally, there's nothing worse than grabbing a black handled knife with your bare hand after being in 130 deg. heat for an hour or two.
Keep in mind, this is all just my $0.02 on the subject. I'm not an expert, but I am a soldier and I've been "down range" and know what has worked or not worked for me.
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Big Smitty
Well-Known Member
On a past project I was able to get Spec Ops to donate 20 sheaths for a military knife build. I'll help with this and anything else if needed.
Ironwolf
The Knife Poet
Thanks Murph,and I agree 100% with the parameters for the design.
I lean towards designs that focus more on utility,that would serve well as a weapon if need be,
and this tanto recurve is my 1st foray into a singular purpose design.
(I did it up mostly just for fun,having never really designed a fightin' knife before).
Most of my more recent ideas feature a "curve-less recurve" blade:
The belly sits lower than the heel of the blade,and it's a straight edge to the sweet-spot.
Looks at first glance like a re-curve,and functions much like one,but easy to sharpen.
I'll post a drawing soon.
I lean towards designs that focus more on utility,that would serve well as a weapon if need be,
and this tanto recurve is my 1st foray into a singular purpose design.
(I did it up mostly just for fun,having never really designed a fightin' knife before).
Most of my more recent ideas feature a "curve-less recurve" blade:
The belly sits lower than the heel of the blade,and it's a straight edge to the sweet-spot.
Looks at first glance like a re-curve,and functions much like one,but easy to sharpen.
I'll post a drawing soon.
Justin King
Well-Known Member
I'm back and liking the designs I see! I have to agree with Murph on the recurved designs for the same reason, although other than that detail I think any of the designs would serve.
I am just off a plane or two and headed to bed, but I thought I'd leave you all with a vacation photo that should go over well with this crowd. Ears are still ringing a little:biggrin:
I am just off a plane or two and headed to bed, but I thought I'd leave you all with a vacation photo that should go over well with this crowd. Ears are still ringing a little:biggrin:
Justin King
Well-Known Member
I am going to propose a last call for designs and a vote from everyone who wants to do a build so we can get this moving. I managed to let the whole week pass without calling Aldo about getting the steel shipped (I know, boo on me) but until we have a design nailed down this ain't going to happen. I will be in touch with Aldo first thing Mon.
We do not know how many blanks will be availible and will not until Dave has the steel and the design in hand, so please keep this in mind if you want to volunteer to do a build. We will make them availible to as many as we can but cannot promise anything at this point.
To everyone who has offered to donate materials for the build, thank you for your offers! I or someone else involved will contact you when we know who needs what.
We do not know how many blanks will be availible and will not until Dave has the steel and the design in hand, so please keep this in mind if you want to volunteer to do a build. We will make them availible to as many as we can but cannot promise anything at this point.
To everyone who has offered to donate materials for the build, thank you for your offers! I or someone else involved will contact you when we know who needs what.
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Bill T
Well-Known Member
Like I said earlier , ALL the designs submitted so far have merit . I really do like them all . As a matter of fact , I would like to MAKE them all . It's a shame we have to chose just one .. And at the risk of hurting anyones feelings , I'll start out the voting with my choice .
I cast my vote for Randy of HHH knives . I think that it is a stout design , that has been thought out very well . The handle design looks safe and has enough flair to it , to still give it plenty of character . I like the wide blade with or without the secondary edge . One of the reasons I chose it was because it was the only design I wouldn't have made any changes to .
Part of the selection process for me is also thinking about Aldo and Dave . This design doesn't seem like a steel waster and looks like anyone can grind it out if need be . I say that because I have a 2x42 with a flat platen only . It makes it hard to do tight , small curves with it .
I think the sheath will be pretty straight-forward to get/make as well .
Like I said , I liked all the designs , but we HAVE to pick just ONE .
I look forward to hear what the rest of you think .
Thanks , Bill
whiteeugene
Well-Known Member
IronWolf I like the flow of the Lil' Pack Rat it looks like the ones I'm sending now very similar in size and shape, but with a convex or scandi grind. From my own experience soldiers tend to use knifes to chop and pry not so much slice. Also the sedge may weaken the tip the example of using a knife to cut a slot out of plywood with a hammer, well that is something a soldier would do only he wouldn’t have a hammer so he would probably use a pipe or tree branch. For my youngest sons first tour I sent him a Leatherman, they were living in conex’s with only the big metal door’s he scrounged some plywood and used the saw blade on the Leatherman to cut full sheets for doors and a rock and the knife blade to notch the wood out so he could saw openings for screen.
I'm in with what ever design you guys chose.
I'm in with what ever design you guys chose.
Justin King
Well-Known Member
I am working on a mid-size design that I think is a better candidate for this than my first submission, it is a bit more compact and less wasteful of material.
I also wanted to comment that whatever design we choose is open to some interpetation by whoever grinds the blank-unless we come to a decision beforehand, details like false edges and grind styles will be up to the individual maker and there is bound to be some variation. I am ok with this as long as we all realize that these knives will be used harder than the average hunting knife, and work with this in mind. Should we be discussing things like minimum edge thickness?
I also wanted to comment that whatever design we choose is open to some interpetation by whoever grinds the blank-unless we come to a decision beforehand, details like false edges and grind styles will be up to the individual maker and there is bound to be some variation. I am ok with this as long as we all realize that these knives will be used harder than the average hunting knife, and work with this in mind. Should we be discussing things like minimum edge thickness?
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Justin King
Well-Known Member
So, if I join Bill T and vote for HHH's design too, it will be unanimous...no one else voting?